Dear Robert: A Debate of Ideologies

By Michael Greer

I am posting the following because it so perfectly demonstrates the kind of conversations we Conservatives have with Liberals everyday on Facebook, Twitter, and other places. They take no responsibility for the division of this country. Even though we on the Right believe the same values Americans have always believed in, the Left calls us extremists. It is the Left that has changed and wants us to follow. No, thank you.

My responses to Robert are in bold (or red).

Robert:

With all due respect Miss MTH, all you did for 8 years was demean, disgrace, lie and wring your hands about the fact that Barrack Obama became our President. You even said: “I had more faith in the American people…” in one of your posts after he easily beat Romney in 2012. And for years, you and your Tea Party pals believed he was not born in America. And what did Obama do? Nothing. He never Tweeted early-morning rants and showed his grace and dignity by his own self-deprecation. And who was the leader of the Birtherism Movement? It was your pal, Donald Trump.

Response:

I did not “demean, disgrace or lie” about Obama. But, yes, I had more faith in the American people than to elect a Marxist, anti-semite who wanted to “fundamentally transform America”. A man whose mentor, Jeremiah Wright, said, “God Damn America”. A man who had his records sealed and the media wasn’t even curious why. Please give me an example of a “lie” I said about Obama. 

I am aware of people not believing Obama was born in America.  Since none of the birth certificates shown were authentic, it is understandable, however, I wasn’t one of them. Any child born to an American citizen in any other country is an American by birth. But the Tea Party in general, was not “Birther”. I’m sure I know more about that as a Tea party organizer than you do. And to be ACCURATE, as I’m sure you want to be, the Clintons were the leaders of the Birther movement. 

I always enjoy Liberals telling us what we think and stand for…..as if you knew. 

Robert:

Doris Parrish is a 96-year-old resident of a southern town here in the USA and has been voting for the last 75 years. This year, she has been told she can’t. A new law in her state requires residents to show a government-issued photo ID in order to vote. Doris doesn’t have a driver’s license, because Doris doesn’t have a car. Doris doesn’t have a passport; a vacation abroad was never in her future.

Response:

Of course she can vote. In every state there are people who will drive her to the DMV to get an ID. I’m sure she knew when she was going to stop driving and could have planned accordingly. After all, ID is required for many things. Why don’t you want her to be able to do the things that require an ID? My mother was 98 when she died last year and up until the day she died, she was capable of getting to the DMV on her own. I know not all 98 year olds are, but someone can help them. 

Robert:

Doris isn’t alone. At this moment, 33 states have proposed or already adopted the same voter I.D. laws that have disqualified Doris Parish from the one fundamental thing that we all do as Americans. We vote. It’s estimated that 11% or roughly 20 million people don’t have government-issued voter I.D.’s and will be disenfranchised this November. Why? To crack down on the “terrible problem” of voter fraud. Governor Rick Perry of Texas is serious about cracking down on the problem. He said: “Making sure that there is not fraud, making sure that someone is not manipulating that process makes all the sense in the world to me.” (and he is now Trump’s Energy Secretary??)

Response:

And Perry was right. As a Governor of a border state, he knows illegal aliens vote. BTW, Unions require voter ID to vote in their elections. Democrats require ID to get into their Convention. Why don’t you want to know if the person voting is who they say they are? BTW, all American’s don’t vote. Only 59.7% of eligible voters voted in 2016.

Robert:

Because voter fraud is such a huge problem that during a five year period in the Bush Administration, when 196 million votes were cast, the number of cases of voter fraud reached 86. Not 86,000. 86. Here’s what that number looks like as a percentage of votes cast. .00004%. Four one hundred thousandths of a percent. This would be called a solution without a problem, but it’s not. It’s just a solution to a different problem.

Republican’s have a hard time getting certain people to vote for them. So life would be a lot easier if certain people just weren’t allowed to vote at all. I’m ashamed to say that 32 out of the 33 voter I.D. laws were proposed by Republican legislators, and passed by Republican-controlled statehouses. And signed into law by Republican governors.

Response:

And I’m proud of Republicans for doing so. I just love how Liberals insist there is no voter fraud….because it ALL benefits them. Please explain to me how you have MORE votes than eligible voters if there is no fraud. 

Please explain why Registrars leave dead people on the rolls, especially the ones who vote. 

There has to be a will to prosecute voter fraud and in Democrat states there is no will. It should be easy to prove fraud when dead people vote. In cases where people are bused from state to state or district to district to vote, it is extremely hard to prove. Project Veritas got a video of a Democrat strategist bragging about bussing people around to vote for 30 years. Explain how that isn’t fraud. 

I have a friend who went to vote on his way home after work and was told he already voted. How do you catch the person who voted in his name? I’m serious, answer these questions for us. 

Eleven districts in California had more votes than eligible voters. Only 59.7% of eligible voters voted in 2016. Therefore, more than 40% of the votes were fraudulent. Explain the following. 

670 VOTES CAST IN GEORGIA PRECINCT WITH 276 VOTERS 

https://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/08/07/voter-fraud-670-ballots-cast-georgia-precinct-276-voters/

https://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/u-s-has-3-5-million-more-registered-voters-than-live-adults-a-red-flag-for-electoral-fraud/

Robert:

Republicans believe in a prohibitive military. They believe in a common sense government. And that there are social programs enacted in the last half-century that work but that there are way too many costing way too much, that don’t. They believe in the rule of law and order and free market capitalism.

Response

Partially, yes. We believe in a strong military. We believe we have the right to defend ourselves and our country. We believe in our country’s sovereignty. Yes, we believe in “common sense government” if by that you mean, Constitutionally limited government. However, I don’t know what social programs you think WE think work. Has the “War on Poverty” worked? After 50 years the same percentage of people are in poverty. How about generations of people living on Welfare? What has that done to the Black families who BEFORE 1965 were strong? BEFORE 1965 Black illegitimate births were about 4% and now are nearly 75%. How’s that working for ya? 

So, my friend, where do Democrat social programs end? You are aware, are you not, that the Democrats are talking about free college, housing, minimum income, as well as Medicare for all. 

And yes, we believe in law and order and free market capitalism. Americans have been for those things as long as I’ve been alive. Who has changed? Not us.

Robert:

The Tea Party believes in loving America but hating Americans. Tea Party Congressman Allen West of Florida said: “I must confess, when I see anyone with an Obama bumper sticker, I recognize them as a threat to the gene pool.” (and that’s why he didn’t get re-elected.) They believe in loving America, but hating its government. Conservative activist, Grover Norquist.said: “I don’t want to abolish government, I simply want to reduce it to the size where I can drag it into the bathroom and drown it in the bathtub.”

Response:

What utter nonsense. Where on earth do you get the Tea Party hates Americans? We ARE Americans. We don’t even hate people who disagree with us. But, yes, we are afraid of those who want to “fundamentally transform America”. Why wouldn’t we be? 

West is right. Those who want to “fundamentally transform” America from a Capitalist, Constitutional America to a Socialist/Communist/globalist country ARE a threat to the gene pool of America. 

And, no, West saying that is NOT why he didn’t get reelected. He was redistricted out of his district. (LOOK IT UP). A Republican candidate from the district West’s district was folded into, stepped aside for West to run and West nearly won in a primarily Democrat district…..and would have if not for voter fraud. 

Robert:

And they believe that anybody who disagrees with the Tea Party has sinister anti-American motives.
Herman Cain said: “The objective of the liberals is to destroy this country. The objective of the liberals is to make America mediocre.” Seriously Herman? (That’s why he did not get re-elected)

Most of all, you must never, under any circumstance, seek to reach a compromise with your opponent. Or do any of what Democrats and genuine Republicans both call ‘governing.’ Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell said in 2009: “Our top political priority over the next two years should be to deny President Obama a second term.”

Response:

No, we don’t think everyone who disagrees with us is Anti-American. We aren’t collectivists. We don’t think every Liberal thinks the same. We know many well meaning but misinformed Liberals. However, having said that, we know many Liberals ARE anti-American. All you have to do is listen to their anti-founding, anti-Constitution, anti-American exceptionalism, anti-Capitalism, anti-White, speech to know that is true. 

There are people in both parties who want global governance (which requires weakening America). The Bushes (Republicans) talked about the NEW WORLD ORDER. If you have been reading my blog you would know I’ve gone to Conferences where they are planning the end of nation states. Why wouldn’t we be against that? Do YOU want that? Even though many of the leaders in BOTH parties want global governance, the ONLY ones fighting against it are Republicans and Trump is one of them. 

BTW, Herman Cain wasn’t “re-elected” because he said that. He never held political office. He was a candidate for President and dropped out when the Left slandered him the way they slandered  Kavanaugh and Thomas. His dropping out had nothing to do with him saying Liberals want to make America mediocre…….especially when MANY Liberals DO. 

Robert:

And one other plank in the Tea Party platform. If you are poor, it means that you are either too lazy or too stupid to be rich. Andre Bauer, Tea Party Leader and the Lt. Governor of South Carolina said: “My grandmother was not a highly educated woman but she told me as a small child to quit feeding stray animals. You know why? Because they breed.” It’s almost hard to believe that Republicans can’t get Doris to vote for them.

Response:

AGAIN, nonsense! Show me where the Tea Party ever said anything of the sort. I have been involved with the Tea Party Patriots since their beginning. Show me where it says that in their “platform”. 

There are ALWAYS going to be people who are either unable or unwilling to take care of themselves. No one begrudges those unable to care for themselves, but few want to support those unwilling….and you know as well as I do, that there are too many UNWILLING. There is nothing “kind” about enabling people, who are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves, to be dependent. We now have more jobs than we can fill. There is no excuse for able bodied people to be on welfare, food stamps or any other freebie. 

Robert:

During Tea Party rallies and in campaign speeches, we’ve been told that America has been founded as a Christian nation and if the founding fathers were here today, they’d tell us so. Here’s John Adams in the treaty of Tripoli: “As the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.” And here’s Thomas Jefferson: “…that our civil rights have no dependence on our religious opinions.” And here’s the first amendment to the US Constitution: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion.”

Response:

I always love Liberals cherry picking founders quotes. The context of that quote was that there is no government religion, that all religions are welcome. He was NOT saying America wasn’t a primarily Christian country, because it was. 

John Adams also said: “Our Constitution was made only for moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”

AND: “Human passions unbridled by morality and religion…would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net.”

And Thomas Jefferson also said: Christianity would be the best religion in a republic, especially one like the United States with a broad diversity of ethnicities and religions.

Robert:

What’s more frightening than the perversion of our great history is that sensible strong smart Republicans, the very men and women who should be standing up to radical fundamentalism, are so frightened in losing primary battles to religious zealots that they’ve thrown in the towel on sanity.

Response:

“Radical fundamentalism”???? I have no idea what that is. It’s something that lives in Liberal brains but nowhere else. The perversion of our “great history” is from those who call our founders “White slave owners”….without pointing out they inherited their slaves and it was against the law to free them. Perversion is saying Columbus was evil because he killed Indians without pointing out the Indians died unintentionally from diseases. Without mentioning the pilgrims got along well with the Indians.  

The perversion is saying the Democrat party wasn’t the party of slavery, the KKK, Jim Crow, segregation, etc. 

Please name the “religious zealots” sensible strong Republicans are losing to. You apparently think “sensible strong Republicans” are those willing to vote with Democrats against the will of their voters. 

Robert:

It’s ironic because the biggest enemy of the phony Republican isn’t Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid or Hillary Clinton or Barrack Obama. It’s this man: (Jesus Christ) He said “Heal the sick. Feed the hungry. Care for the weakest among us. And always pray in private.”

Response:

WOW! WOOP, THERE IT IS! Jesus is the enemy??? WOW!

Robert/Response:

The Tea Party believes:
Ideological purity – no, we believe in individual liberty
Compromise as weakness – we ALWAYS compromise, you DON’T
A fundamentalist belief in scriptural literalism – Many in the TP are Christians but the Tea Party has no position on religion.
Denying science – LOL! No, we actually believe in science. Democrats don’t believe your DNA determines your sex. 
Unmoved by facts – what facts have you provided? 
Undeterred by new information – LOL!
A hostile fear of progress – how is resource rationing, no cars, no private property “progress”??
A demonization of education – when we went from first in the world to not in the top ten, education SHOULD be demonized.
A need to control women’s bodies – no, a desire to protect life. BIG difference. Woman know how to prevent pregnancy.
Severe xenophobia – again, no, we aren’t the ones who are obsessed with race.
Tribal mentality – we aren’t the ones who walk in lockstep. We’re not collectivists who want everyone the same. We’re like herding cats.
Intolerance of dissent – we aren’t silencing anyone, Liberals are.
A pathological hatred of the US government – LOL, thanks for demonstrating how unhinged the Left is. We don’t hate government, we just want a Constitutionally limited government.

Robert:

They can call themselves the Tea Party. They can call themselves Conservatives. And they can even call themselves Republicans. Though Republican’s certainly shouldn’t. But we should call them what they are: The American Taliban. And the American Taliban cannot survive if Doris is allowed to vote. And you, Madderthanhell, are worried about Trump not being honored or recognized as a true leader of our country? Today he said: “I think the shootings at a Synagogue in Pittsburgh, PA were ‘anti-semitic.’” Ya think? It is no wonder he is starting to be rejected by so many. And? Yes, it was due to the anti-semitism supported by LIBERALS! Why would anyone disagree with that? Can you deny the anti-semitism on our college campuses? Your beloved Obama was pals with Louis Farrakhan, the biggest anti-semite on the planet.

Response

Tea Party is the “Taliban”??? Gee, there’s a unifying statement. The Tea Party supports the things we, as a country, have supported all my life. How is that destructive? We haven’t changed, the Left has. Can you deny the Left was FOR secure borders, for marriage between a man and a women, two genders, Capitalism, free speech, due process?  It’s DEMOCRATS who have changed. We believe in the SAME THINGS we have always believed in.

Robert:

Rejecting Trump by anyone is absolutely justified these days. Republicans are leaving him in droves as they have finally realized they voted for a TV personality. I see that others have called you out for being a Fox News disciple. I agree with them. If you sit around and watch or listen to people like Rush, Hannity, Beck, Ingraham all day, you are bound to be brain-washed by nonsense.

Response:

ALL Liberals can say is Conservatives sit around watching FOX. That is your go to argument. If you believe FOX is biased, why do you think your media isn’t?  That’s the only argument you ever make…that we watch FOX. That way you can just dismiss everything we say. If you read my blog you would know I don’t get my information from FOX. I get my information first hand from the people involved in politics, in planning, in science. I go and speak to the people involved. I’m friends with people involved.

If you think Trump supporters are leaving him you are DREAMING. Not only aren’t they leaving, we are being joined by former Democrats. #WalkAway. Especially, Blacks. 37% APPROVAL from Blacks.

Have you seen Trump rallies? He not only fills the stadiums, nearly as many are outside wanting to get in. But dream on.

Robert:

You say you love your grandchildren and have two daughters. Go spend time with them rather than vomiting out fundamentalist right-wing bull-crap. If you want to help America, I suggest you write things and find ways where we can converse with each other rather than being Madder than Hell and can bring all of us together again because we will ALWAYS be: WE THE PEOPLE.

What will it take to heal our country? With all the anger and division…we now need contagious optimism from everyone no matter who they vote for, what their skin color is or where they reside. Please try writing about that in your blog.

Response:

I have written about it.

I spend lots of time with my family. I’m perfectly capable of walking and chewing gum at the same time.

If YOU want to heal America stop telling us we are “vomiting out fundamentalist right-wing bull-crap”. Stop saying we get our information from FOX. Stop calling us racists, bigots, homophobes, Islamaphobes, religious zealots, etc. Stop pretending you have the moral high ground. Stop pretending you are the tolerant, inclusive people when you are actively slandering, silencing and insulting us.

You are completely intolerant of the Right and your only suggestion is for US to conform to YOU. How about you stop insulting us. How about YOU start being inclusive of Conservatives, White men, sovereignty, the Constitution, Capitalism and the Rule of Law?

 

Respectfully, There was NOTHING respectful of what you said.

 


Michael Greer

Michael Greer retired from the film/television industry and is the co-organizer of the Santa Monica Tea Party and the Los Angeles Tea Party, on the board of directors of the Citizens’ Alliance for Property Rights and was a member of the Republican Central Committee for the 41st Assembly District.  Her website is: http://madderthanhell.wordpress.com/


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